Blue Jays & Guardians
Submitted by: pezzicle
Blue Jays
| Name | Age | Level | P1 | P2 | Availability | Years | AFV | Salary | Surplus | Low | Median | High |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Will Brennan | Minors | OF | 4.3 | 3.4 | 4.3 | 5.2 | ||||||
| Aaron Civale | 27 | Majors | SP | Low | 3 | 29.6 | 11 | 18.6 | 14.9 | 18.6 | 22.3 | |
| Milan Tolentino | Minors | SS | 2.6 | 2.1 | 2.6 | 3.1 | ||||||
| Gavin Williams | Minors | RHP | 28.4 | 22.7 | 28.4 | 34.1 |
Total Value:
53.9
Guardians
| Name | Age | Level | P1 | P2 | Availability | Years | AFV | Salary | Surplus | Low | Median | High |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Gabriel Moreno | 22 | Majors | C | Low | 6 | 65.8 | 12.1 | 53.7 | 42.9 | 53.7 | 64.4 |
Total Value:
53.7
Comments
12Jays don't get worse at all this year and get a 3/4 SP and a LHH OFer who can play all 3 positions, and they add a legit SP prospect and a whatever MI
Cleveland says no. They have been unwilling to trade Gavin Williams in a package for Sean Murphy, so I don't see it happening here either. Cleveland also values the catcher position greatly, so I don't see them going with two rookies at catcher. They have their own top 100 prospect catcher in Bo Naylor. Cleveland says no.
Jays need 2 SP and an OF. It is assumed that is the key focus of the C trades. Civale & Williams is just not strong enough for them. Maybe if they were rebuilding but they need to go all in right now
Sorry what? Toronto needs a 3/4. That is exactly what Civale is if healthy. He pitched to a 3.55 ERA after he came back from injury last year. He was awful to start because he was clearly hurt. His last 13 starts he was a 3.55 ERA and 3.35 FIP pitcher. That's exactly what they need to slot in behind Berrios. White/Kikuchi are good enough to be SP5, and Williams is very likely to be ready by end of year playoff push
Civale has been a league average SP. The Jays would be interested in him if we are talking about Danny Jansen but not for Moreno. I would also like for them to have more SP depth like Williams but its unlikely they would trade the top catching prospect in baseball for a SP who most often has been 4th not a 3rd SP and a top 75ish prospect. Moreno appears to be the least likely of the 3 catchers traded. Even though personally I might trade him over Kirk & Jano. However Cle did heavily scout Kirk last year, even had someone following him in spring training.
cost of pitching is very high. If Walker, a No.3 is getting 18M a year, Civale, a No.4 is likely able to get 12M a year over the 3 years of control he has. He likely makes 10M overall. That's a lot of value. You also are completely ignoring Brennan who could be a very good LFer for years to come with his hit tool. Not a lot of power in that bat, but TOR doesn't need that. He also has 6 years of control.
Teams don't usually give up elite prospects like Moreno for pieces and a 4th SP. That is why I say if the Jays want Civale they would look at Jano. You need a bigger chip to get Moreno, in reality teams don't give their best young player for a field of average players.
Actually, Brennan is a better CFer than corner OFer. Don't get me wrong, he can play all 3, but his strength is CF. Also, his power is developing and if you've watched him play at all you'd know that a good bit of his HR go to the opposite field. I'd rather deal Straw to Toronto than Brennan. How about Quantrill, Karinchak and Straw for Moreno? If no, then Karinchak and a lower level SP prospect for Jansen. I know how this site values Quantrill, but I promise you he holds a lot more value to Cleveland than he is listed here. I'd like for someone to do a comparison. Take the top 5 rated SP prospects you can find and compare Williams to them. Then tell me if you'd trade him at 28.5. He's the best SP taken in the 2021 draft. Please don't think I'm undervaluing Moreno. The kid is a stud. What you have to consider is how good Bo Naylor is and then factor in if losing Williams for Moreno is worth it. I don't think it is at this time.
for some reason I can't respond to you directly, but Williams isn't "pieces" He's a top 50 prospect
NEWSLETTER? SURE, SIGN ME UP!
The two rookie thing is the only thing imo that stands in the way. I get why they don't trade Williams for 3 years of Murphy, but you're getting 6 years of Moreno here. Much different beast. but yes, I suspect they would be very hesitant to run 2 rookie catchers, which is likely the main impediment
Gavin Williams is the impediment as well. Cleveland has been a team built around pitching and defense and Williams is a key piece of their future. Mello, you need to do more homework on Williams.
I think they would be willing to trade Williams for Moreno given the years of control. They have so much upper level pitching. Williams, Espino, Bibee, Allen, Cantillo, Morris. Williams is great, don't get me wrong, but I do wonder if they could afford to trade ONE of them